3 comments on “Scotland!

  1. Hi there, My grandfather was James Clough of the KOSB – he was killed in June 1916. I believe however that there were 2 soldiers fron the KOSB by the name of James Clough, who were both killed during WW1.One was a Cpl , the other, my grandfather was a private. I dont believe it will be my grandfather, as I still have his memorial plaque (dead mans penny). All the same it would be nice to hear from you if the project was about my relative. Regards, Kevin.

    • Hi Kevin,
      I am very excited to hear from you as I had never thought I might find a possible relative of the James Clough that I researched. The way the assignment worked was that my professor walked into our lecture hall one day with a suitcase. He emptied the suitcase which was filled with memorial plaques out on a table and had all the students come and select one at random. We then had to find as much as we possibly could about the soldier whose name was on our plaques. We were allowed to look at the plaques for a few minutes, and then we had to find our soldier’s regimental number on a list he had already created. The regimental identification number of the James Clough that I researched was 8422 and he was a private. The fact that he was a private makes me think that maybe I did research your grandfather. The death date that I have for James Clough is June 16, 1915. This is close enough to the date that you gave me, June 1916, that I can easily see the numbers getting transposed somewhere. I was trying to think of how I could have researched your grandfather while you still had the plaque, so it may be due to there being multiple James Cloughs. If my professor found a James Clough that died in WWI, he may have then written down that regimental number and stopped looking for other James Cloughs. I also know that he was selling that particular memorial plaque on ebay about a year ago.
      The paper I wrote on James Clough has unfortunately been lost between several computer crashes since I wrote the paper in 2010. I did however keep my records that I printed out while researching, so I can still tell you about the James Clough that I researched. I had some difficulties while researching so there is a margin of error. I have been told that around 50% of the old WWI records were destroyed in the Blitz and it looks like James Clough’s records were among those destroyed. Also, crazily enough, the British National Archives went on strike just as we were getting the assignment, so I had very limited access to records through the archives. I was mostly successful at finding information through the Commonwealth War Graves Commission and through census records. This only gave me a tiny glimpse of James Clough approximately every 10 years when census records were taken so I had to do a lot of reading between the lines. That being said, here is what I learned about the Private James Clough whose regimental id # is 8422.
      James Clough was married to Eliza Clough and according to their 1901 census records (I could not find their 1911 census records) they had three children, Janey, Constance, and James. in 1901 James Clough (8422) was 26 years old and employed as a coal carter. They lived in Ashton-under-Lyne, Lancashire. At that point they were living at 15 Mount Pleasant Street and they had a boarder living with them named Jonathon Shufflebottom. There were a bunch of Cloughs living in Ashton-under-Lyne – he and his son were not the only James Cloughs living there. The way I was able to track this James Clough rather than the other James Cloughs was that his death records state that he was married to Eliza, so I had to look for Eliza’s name in conjunction with James Clough to make sure I had the correct James Clough. His son James also fought in WWI and his records survived, though he joined at the very end of the war (he was born 5/5/1900 so he only turned 18 in the very last year of the war). According to his records he wanted to be in the dragoons (there is a line on his forms asking where you would like to be placed) and it looks like he ended up in the King’s Own Royal Lancaster Regiment. This James Clough listed Eliza as his mother and was still at the same address that was listed for his father when he died, 23 Junction Street, Ashton-under-Lyne.
      James Clough (8422) would have been around 39 years old when WWI began so he was on the somewhat older end of the spectrum of soldiers. Since I could not find his 1911 census I am not exactly sure what he was up to between 1901 and the start of the war, but he seems to have gone from a coal carter to one of the first groups to be deployed. He was in the KOSB 2nd Battalion and they landed at Havre on 15/8/14. His identification number is also a pretty low number, so he may have already been in the army when the war broke out, or joined very early. He was in the Aldershot theater of war and died in Ypres. His records merely say “died of wounds” so what actually happened to him is not clear. He died not terribly long after the Second Battle of Ypres and is buried in a graveyard there, so my theory was that he may have been injured during that battle and died later. He is buried at Dickebusch New Military Cemetery in Ypres, section E.3. There are also a lot of Australians buried in his cemetery which made me think it was still an active cemetery during the 3rd Battle of Ypres, Passchendaele, where many Australians died. That would make him one of the later people buried there from the Second Battle of Ypres.
      I also have some earlier census information that I think was the James Clough I was researching (the ages match), but without Eliza’s name connected, I can’t be sure. If I did find the correct younger James, his mother was Hannah Clough. The two of them were boarders living with an Ellen Driver in Ashton-under-Lyne when James was 6 according to the 1881 census. In their 1891 census they were still boarders, but they were living in Wigan. The handwriting is a bit difficult to make out on this document, but James appears to have been employed as a cotton laborer and Hannah is listed as a cotton spinner.
      I hope this was helpful to you, and it certainly would be very cool if I had indeed researched your ancestor. I actually have a kind of silly question for you. I have only seen Clough written on paper and have been wondering how it is pronounced, as I can think of several sounds “ough” makes. I thought when I picked his memorial plaque that he had such a unique name it would be easy to find him, never realizing how many James Cloughs there were, even just in Ashton-under-Lyne. Thank you for your interest, and I hope you have a great day!
      Sincerely,
      Jessica

  2. Hi Jessica,
    Sorry I haven’t got back to you before – truth is I have only just found your response.

    From your reply, I am 100% certain that you did in fact research my grandfather. Eliza was my grandmother and their children in descending age order were James, Janey (Jennie), Constance (Connie), Robert and Eric. Eric was my father. He was only just over two years old when his father (my grandfather) was killed and so never really new him. They are all now sadly deceased.

    I am so sorry that I didnt know of your research at the time you undertook it. I could have assisted you and perhaps filled in gaps, even given you a copy of a family group photograph to use. I have a copy of a family group photograph of all seven relatives named above. It was taken in 1914 !

    The matter of the plaque is a mystery – though I remain certain of the authenticity of mine as I know for certain it was handed down through the generations without leaving the family. There are as you say many of them about and can be bought on Ebay for around $25. I would never sell mine though.

    My grandfathers service number was 8422 and you are right that he rejoined the army as he was too old for conscription in 1914/15. His enlistment has ever since been a matter of great debate within the family (certainly between my father and aunts and uncles).

    He was in fact wounded at the second battle of Ypres (Leper as it is now known) and died of his wounds in a field hospital. I believe this to have been some weeks later, hence the gap between the second battle ending and his death. I dont have much information on this as it was never really discussed, (probably because it became common knowledge that there was some terrible suffering amongst the wounded at that time – even more so that modern days, due to medical inadequacies and conditions generally).

    Our name – Clough – was a very common one in and around the Manchester area of Lancashire at that time. It dates back to medieval times and refers to families living in small valleys or near to a small stream. Such areas locally in England were often referred to as ‘Cloughs’. There is a small recreation area near to where I live which is still known as ‘Boggart – old – Clough’. It is simply as I said a small stream running through a valley where people used to walk, picnic and generally socialise in previous generations. Sadly not used as much now apart from mainly dog walking.
    I notice your comments about the pronunciation of our name. This is on of the many anomalies of the great English language which we Brits use. Best way I can help is to perhaps say that phonetically it is pronounced as KLUFF.

    I have just been to London to look at the poppies which have been placed around the moat of the the Tower of London. 888,246 of them – one for each English soldier killed in WW1. It is an awesome sight. Search Tower of London poppies on Google if you want to look at some photographs which people have posted.

    It really was great to hear from you, and I feel quite proud in a strange sort of way that my grandfather was researched in such a way.

    If you want to communicate further please use my email address as I will pick it up much sooner. I received no notification of you reply and only came back to it by chance. (kevin.clough1@ntlworld.com)

    Good luck and all the best for the future,

    Regards, Kevin.

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